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Dream3
Cruiser Addict
Posted: Sep 12, 2006, 11:35 AM
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Spark PLugs
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Okay guy's, I called two aut stores 1) O'Reileys 2) Auto Zone to go get some new spark plugs for my PT before I make this trip to Okla this weekend. I asked about NGK 430 Copper Spark Plugs & neither store never heard about these. SO once again I am asking what kind of spark plugs does everyone use? And that are best with the 2.4L Turbo engine? And what number do you have them gapped at? I'd like to get it done this Thursday before I make my trip!! Thanks Guy's ~
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Crystal~ Life is like road trip & really sweet in a PT Cruiser! #1276
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Posts: 546 | From: Kansas
| Registered: Sep 6, 2004, 9:06 PM
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GT Bruiser
Cruiser Expert
Posted: Sep 12, 2006, 1:10 PM
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Re: [Dream3] Spark PLugs
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Hi Dream3,
There's a ton of info on this site about the best, the most correct, the worse, etc. plugs. I just installed Champion 3032 Platinums gapped at .35. There was a tremendous increase in power, acceleration and overall driveability. It could be that my GT is running better because is got a 4 pack of NEW plugs, not necessarily BETTER plugs. Only time and mileage will prove their quality.
I went with the 3032's as I believed the argument made was a good one based on informed opinions. Mostly, that they run cooler than the stock Champion 440's.
What you're not telling is how many miles you have on the plugs currently in there and how old the wires are. The OEM wires have proven themselves to be junk after less than 14K. There's a ton of resistance and the core tends to break from extended exposure to underhood heat from the turbo.
The plugs are available at any NAPA. At around $2.50 per plug I'd consider it a very small risk should they not work out in the long run.
Good luck.
Regards!
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Intense Blue Pearl... Yeah, Baby! 2003 GT - 5 Speed Getrag - Factory Loaded W/Ghost Flames, Borla Cat Back Dual Exhaust. "I Suck At Electric".
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Posts: 339 | From: Twin Cities, MN
| Registered: Dec 15, 2004, 3:52 PM
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rszappa1
Cruiser Expert
Posted: Sep 12, 2006, 2:56 PM
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Re: [GT Bruiser] Spark PLugs
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 I thought that Platuim is a no no for the turbo...
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Posts: 235 | From: louisville, KY
| Registered: Dec 23, 2003, 11:50 PM
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rszappa1
Cruiser Expert
Posted: Sep 12, 2006, 2:57 PM
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Re: [Dream3] Spark PLugs
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The number for the NGK is 4306.
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Posts: 235 | From: louisville, KY
| Registered: Dec 23, 2003, 11:50 PM
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GT Bruiser
Cruiser Expert
Posted: Sep 12, 2006, 5:38 PM
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Re: [rszappa1] Spark PLugs
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Not according to: http://www.championsparkplugs.com/...app.asp?AAIA=1412468
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Intense Blue Pearl... Yeah, Baby! 2003 GT - 5 Speed Getrag - Factory Loaded W/Ghost Flames, Borla Cat Back Dual Exhaust. "I Suck At Electric".
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Posts: 339 | From: Twin Cities, MN
| Registered: Dec 15, 2004, 3:52 PM
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rszappa1
Cruiser Expert
Posted: Sep 12, 2006, 5:50 PM
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Re: [GT Bruiser] Spark PLugs
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 The 4306 that i am talking about is the NGK V groove copper plug....
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Posts: 235 | From: louisville, KY
| Registered: Dec 23, 2003, 11:50 PM
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GT Bruiser
Cruiser Expert
Posted: Sep 12, 2006, 6:26 PM
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Re: [rszappa1] Spark PLugs
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 Yeah, but I was referring to your post from 2:56PM.
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Intense Blue Pearl... Yeah, Baby! 2003 GT - 5 Speed Getrag - Factory Loaded W/Ghost Flames, Borla Cat Back Dual Exhaust. "I Suck At Electric".
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Posts: 339 | From: Twin Cities, MN
| Registered: Dec 15, 2004, 3:52 PM
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rszappa1
Cruiser Expert
Posted: Sep 12, 2006, 6:36 PM
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Re: [GT Bruiser] Spark PLugs
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 And I was refering to your post before that. You mentioned that you put in platinum plugs...Don't you have a turbo? I thought that that is a NO NO for the Turbo....
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Posts: 235 | From: louisville, KY
| Registered: Dec 23, 2003, 11:50 PM
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GT Bruiser
Cruiser Expert
Posted: Sep 12, 2006, 6:40 PM
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Re: [rszappa1] Spark PLugs
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Quote:
And I was refering to your post before that. You mentioned that you put in platinum plugs...Don't you have a turbo? I thought that that is a NO NO for the Turbo....
Not according to: http://www.championsparkplugs.com/...app.asp?AAIA=1412468
It's a timing thing RS. I do have a Turbo. The above link is to the Champion website.
Regards!
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Intense Blue Pearl... Yeah, Baby! 2003 GT - 5 Speed Getrag - Factory Loaded W/Ghost Flames, Borla Cat Back Dual Exhaust. "I Suck At Electric".
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Posts: 339 | From: Twin Cities, MN
| Registered: Dec 15, 2004, 3:52 PM
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rszappa1
Cruiser Expert
Posted: Sep 12, 2006, 6:44 PM
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Re: [GT Bruiser] Spark PLugs
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I was refering to you 110 pm post....So what plugs are you running in your turbo...the way i read it ...sounds like it was platinum....
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Posts: 235 | From: louisville, KY
| Registered: Dec 23, 2003, 11:50 PM
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GT Bruiser
Cruiser Expert
Posted: Sep 12, 2006, 6:52 PM
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Re: [rszappa1] Spark PLugs
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You are correct. I am running Champion 3032 Platinum plugs. They are NOT the Double Plats. The 3032's run colder than the stock copper plugs, hence no preignition/detonation when hot and under boost.
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Intense Blue Pearl... Yeah, Baby! 2003 GT - 5 Speed Getrag - Factory Loaded W/Ghost Flames, Borla Cat Back Dual Exhaust. "I Suck At Electric".
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Posts: 339 | From: Twin Cities, MN
| Registered: Dec 15, 2004, 3:52 PM
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rszappa1
Cruiser Expert
Posted: Sep 12, 2006, 7:00 PM
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Re: [GT Bruiser] Spark PLugs
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OK...All that I read on the sites say that they are a NO NO in the turbo. I remember calling Bosch about two montha ago for the correct plug for the PT and when I told them that it was a Turbo...They said that they do not make or reccomend a Platinum Plug for the turbo....Yet Autolite shows one for it along with champion and NGK....What Gives?????
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Posts: 235 | From: louisville, KY
| Registered: Dec 23, 2003, 11:50 PM
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ryukenden
Cruiser Buff
Posted: Sep 12, 2006, 10:03 PM
Post #13 of 43
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Re: [Dream3] Spark PLugs
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Iridium IX Plug; LZTR5AIX-13...
the fine electrode tip allows you to gap to .28
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2004 GT Stage 1, Mopar BOV
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Posts: 78 | From: Austin. TX
| Registered: Nov 27, 2004, 11:40 PM
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techie007
Cruiser Fan
Posted: Sep 13, 2006, 5:04 PM
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Re: Spark PLugs
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Did you ever get the feeling of deja vu?
Did you ever get the feeling of deja vu? ;)
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Cheers,
techie007
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Posts: 27 | From: London, Ontario, Canada
| Registered: Jul 21, 2006, 6:31 PM
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rszappa1
Cruiser Expert
Posted: Sep 13, 2006, 5:27 PM
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Re: [techie007] Spark PLugs
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yup
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Posts: 235 | From: louisville, KY
| Registered: Dec 23, 2003, 11:50 PM
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Dream3
Cruiser Addict
Posted: Sep 13, 2006, 9:50 PM
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Re: [rszappa1] Spark PLugs
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Okay here is the update...Instead of calling I went directly to O'Reily Auto Parts & inquired about NGK 4306 copper,Denso ITL20 Iridium & Champion Iridium 9403 & 3032. The interesting thing is that he did honestly look for ea. of these, they were either "Never heard of these" (NGK), For an older model car "99 (Champion 3032) or or that # doesn't exist, finally I said okay I Have a "04 PT Turbo Cruiser & I need some plugs, so he flipped through this big book & read "the recommended" I said okay, My car now has Double PLatinum 7570 gapped at .030, the spark plugs that were removed were veryblack almost burnt looking & gapped at .060...pretty wide & my car only had at the time of change 26,671 miles. Whew okay ,I got through that one! Now for a bit more advice...I believe that I previously read that the "wires" should be replaced.... So what kind does each person use & why & is it with Turbo? Cheers & Beer to all who helped! Greatly appreciated!
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Crystal~ Life is like road trip & really sweet in a PT Cruiser! #1276
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Posts: 546 | From: Kansas
| Registered: Sep 6, 2004, 9:06 PM
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mean green
Cruiser Addict
Posted: Sep 13, 2006, 11:44 PM
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Re: [Dream3] Spark PLugs
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Platinum plugs in a turbo, eh. What kind of assinine info was that? Platinum plugs will eventually melt in a turbo car because turbo cars run hotter. Platinum plugs are for non turbo's. Better get those platinum plugs out of there and if you don't believe me go here and tell these hardcore PT turbo gearheads you're running platinum plugs in a turbo. You'll have to copy and paste the URL.
http://www.ptcrew.com/index.php
I used Magnecor wires on my high performance '03 GT amd MSD wires on my high performance SRT-4. I also used Copper Plus plugs in both cars, the GT gapped at .040 and the srt at .035. Both cars pull like a runaway freight train.
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2005 Stone White SRT4
2004 Graphite Auto
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Posts: 844 | From: Oregon
| Registered: Feb 19, 2002, 12:00 AM
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GT Bruiser
Cruiser Expert
Posted: Sep 14, 2006, 7:02 AM
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Re: [mean green] Spark PLugs
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Quote:
Platinum plugs in a turbo, eh. What kind of assinine info was that? Platinum plugs will eventually melt in a turbo car because turbo cars run hotter. Platinum plugs are for non turbo's. Better get those platinum plugs out of there and if you don't believe me go here and tell these hardcore PT turbo gearheads you're running platinum plugs in a turbo. You'll have to copy and paste the URL.
This simply isn't true. The melting point of platinum is 3224 degrees Farenheit, while copper melts at 1981.4 degrees Farenheit. Iridium melts at 4471 degrees Farenheit. The trick is to balance out the coolness of the plug against the intended application. That's accomplished through the ceramic jacket and electrode cone projection.
Regards!
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Intense Blue Pearl... Yeah, Baby! 2003 GT - 5 Speed Getrag - Factory Loaded W/Ghost Flames, Borla Cat Back Dual Exhaust. "I Suck At Electric".
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Posts: 339 | From: Twin Cities, MN
| Registered: Dec 15, 2004, 3:52 PM
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TomsCruise
Cruiser Buff
Posted: Sep 14, 2006, 8:13 AM
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Re: [GT Bruiser] Spark PLugs
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Platinum plugs do not work well in a GT period. Deen is right they will cause you more headaches. I haved iridiums and love them. They are gapped at .028 for my mods and after 15K they are still the shizzle.
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03 Electric Blue GT 5 Speed
S1, Quaife, Hurst and other
goodies. 14.3 @96.31
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Posts: 59 | From: Chambersburg PA
| Registered: Apr 28, 2006, 7:55 AM
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mean green
Cruiser Addict
Posted: Sep 14, 2006, 9:21 AM
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Re: [GT Bruiser] Spark PLugs
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Quote:
Quote:
Platinum plugs in a turbo, eh. What kind of assinine info was that? Platinum plugs will eventually melt in a turbo car because turbo cars run hotter. Platinum plugs are for non turbo's. Better get those platinum plugs out of there and if you don't believe me go here and tell these hardcore PT turbo gearheads you're running platinum plugs in a turbo. You'll have to copy and paste the URL.
This simply isn't true. The melting point of platinum is 3224 degrees Farenheit, while copper melts at 1981.4 degrees Farenheit. Iridium melts at 4471 degrees Farenheit. The trick is to balance out the coolness of the plug against the intended application. That's accomplished through the ceramic jacket and electrode cone projection.
Regards!
Go to that site I asked Dream3 to check out. You got people there running close to 400 hp in their PT turbo's. My friend dynoed at 331 whp in his GT monster with a big turbo and supporting mods. There are several DCX techs on that site who will tell you the same thing. Copy and paste this URL to the SRT Forum site.
http://www.srtforums.com/
Got people there running 400-500 whp on their SRT-4's. It's a very knowledgeable site as the SRT-4 shares the same engine with the PT turbo. People there run with a colder than stock plug, some with irridium plugs and nobody with platinum plugs. Check that site out. It's a great place to soak up all kinds of info.
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2005 Stone White SRT4
2004 Graphite Auto
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Posts: 844 | From: Oregon
| Registered: Feb 19, 2002, 12:00 AM
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GT Bruiser
Cruiser Expert
Posted: Sep 14, 2006, 9:26 AM
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Re: [TomsCruise] Spark PLugs
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Quote:
Platinum plugs do not work well in a GT period. Deen is right they will cause you more headaches. I haved iridiums and love them. They are gapped at .028 for my mods and after 15K they are still the shizzle.
I respectfully disagree with your opinion TomsCruiser.
Iridiums plugs have one advantage over platinum plugs: they (iridiums) have approximately 1/2 the resistance of platinum, though this is easily overcome by dropping in any aftermarket set of 7mm or bigger wires which will intrinsically have a lower-than-OEM resistance rating.
However, iridiums biggest pitfall is it's extremely brittle nature. It's virtually non malleable, and though very hard, can fracture because it is so hard. I would have a hard time believing that an iridium electrode could be damaged during normal service, but a drop prior to installation could, in fact, fracture the electrode. It would really suck to have any part of the iridium electrode drop into the engine. Kiss the cylinder walls, piston, and rings goodbye, Georgie-Porgie.
Interestingly, iridium belongs to the elemental grouping called platinum group metals and is often added to platinum to strengthen and raise it's hardness level.
Platinum, on the other hand is highly malleable and conforms more easily to it's environmental demands meaning it can't fracture or break even from a pre-installation drop or under detonation. It's creep factor is also better than copper simply because it has a higher melting point.
Anti-corrosion in iridium is also superior to platinum. This asset is hardly applicable though as both are installed inside the engine's environment but neither are exposed to the environment that could cause corrosion albeit the engine's internal chemistry can, and does, corrode aluminum, iron, and steel.
Now, take the cost per unit of iridiums vs. platinum vs. copper and extrapolate against service life. You'll find platinums to offer the biggest bang for the buck having 3X longer life than copper at only 30-35% increase of cost per unit and 66% life against iridium at only 1/3rd the cost.
What this entrie discussion really boils down to is this: Iridium plugs are currently the best on the market, followed by platinum plugs, then copper. Yes, in that order.
All this and platinum still won't melt anywhere near copper's melting point which was the point I initially attempted to make. Perhaps the best alloy for plugs is platinum & rhodium as rhodium is the best conductor of any of these noble metals and platinum brings longevity to the party. Ah yes... ignition Viagara.
Regards!
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Intense Blue Pearl... Yeah, Baby! 2003 GT - 5 Speed Getrag - Factory Loaded W/Ghost Flames, Borla Cat Back Dual Exhaust. "I Suck At Electric".
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Posts: 339 | From: Twin Cities, MN
| Registered: Dec 15, 2004, 3:52 PM
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GT Bruiser
Cruiser Expert
Posted: Sep 14, 2006, 9:54 AM
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Re: [mean green] Spark PLugs
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Quote:
This simply isn't true. The melting point of platinum is 3224 degrees Farenheit, while copper melts at 1981.4 degrees Farenheit. Iridium melts at 4471 degrees Farenheit. The trick is to balance out the coolness of the plug against the intended application. That's accomplished through the ceramic jacket and electrode cone projection.
Regards!
Go to that site I asked Dream3 to check out. You got people there running close to 400 hp in their PT turbo's. My friend dynoed at 331 whp in his GT monster with a big turbo and supporting mods. There are several DCX techs on that site who will tell you the same thing. Copy and paste this URL to the SRT Forum site.
http://www.srtforums.com/
Got people there running 400-500 whp on their SRT-4's. It's a very knowledgeable site as the SRT-4 shares the same engine with the PT turbo. People there run with a colder than stock plug, some with irridium plugs and nobody with platinum plugs. Check that site out. It's a great place to soak up all kinds of info.
Hello Mean Green,
Please understand that my initial response to your posting was in referencing your claim that platinum plugs will melt. I retorted with proof that this simply isn't possible. I do not dispute your claims of performance against iridium plugs, or in a minor capacity against copper plugs' thermal conductivity and electrical resistance.
However, as I stated, these nominal properties/variations can be overcome by utilizing better-than-oem plug wires. That will get more of the coil's spark to the plugs regardless of the plugs used.
Oh yeah, before I forget. The iridium plugs most commonly have platinum tipped electrodes. So even those gear heads should know they've actually got a little platinum in there too.
I'll stick with my plats until springtime. Then, I'll see what kind of where & tear appears to warrant any changes or upgrades to iridium.
Your reference to the PT/SRT-4 having the same engine poses a question from me. If they're the same engine, why can't I drop in the Stage 3 SRT-4 turbo upgrade? PCM? Emissions equipment? Many of the local dealers' parts department guys I've spoken with have told me it's a no-fit as the engines are not the same design/construction. Me? I'd really love to go full out Stage 3 w/ Turbo Toys.
Regards!
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Intense Blue Pearl... Yeah, Baby! 2003 GT - 5 Speed Getrag - Factory Loaded W/Ghost Flames, Borla Cat Back Dual Exhaust. "I Suck At Electric".
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Posts: 339 | From: Twin Cities, MN
| Registered: Dec 15, 2004, 3:52 PM
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TomsCruise
Cruiser Buff
Posted: Sep 14, 2006, 10:31 AM
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Re: [GT Bruiser] Spark PLugs
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Stage3 can be done on a PT but preferably a stick. Automatics have problems of their own and are much more difficult to adapt. Yes Grace a stage3 can be put in a 5sp GT but it is expensive which is why I turned it down.
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03 Electric Blue GT 5 Speed
S1, Quaife, Hurst and other
goodies. 14.3 @96.31
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Posts: 59 | From: Chambersburg PA
| Registered: Apr 28, 2006, 7:55 AM
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GT Bruiser
Cruiser Expert
Posted: Sep 14, 2006, 11:22 AM
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Re: [TomsCruise] Spark PLugs
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Well at least I have the Getrag 5-speed... and it's been professionally rebuilt with new clutch, throwout bearing, pressure place, etc.
Ouch! $4200.00 for the S3? Do you know if it requires firewall alterations for fitment?
I see you're running the Quaife differential. Did it make a noticeable performance gain? I thought it was only for the Neon T-305 MTX and non-turbo PT (P/N P5007382). I'm assuming you disconnected the Trac Control?
So would the Stage 3 require electronics upgrades/changes or can I run with the OEM PCM and emissions controls (other than S3 required changes)? I really dislike auto electric work. Oh, I can do it... I'm just not as flexible and small handed as I used to be.
Regards!
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Intense Blue Pearl... Yeah, Baby! 2003 GT - 5 Speed Getrag - Factory Loaded W/Ghost Flames, Borla Cat Back Dual Exhaust. "I Suck At Electric".
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Posts: 339 | From: Twin Cities, MN
| Registered: Dec 15, 2004, 3:52 PM
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TomsCruise
Cruiser Buff
Posted: Sep 14, 2006, 11:29 AM
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Re: [GT Bruiser] Spark PLugs
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The Quaife is awesome and was installed by Tommjy at Haynes. I've had it for two years now and no problems. I only turn off the trac control at the track.
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03 Electric Blue GT 5 Speed
S1, Quaife, Hurst and other
goodies. 14.3 @96.31
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Posts: 59 | From: Chambersburg PA
| Registered: Apr 28, 2006, 7:55 AM
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